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Phil Douglis | all galleries >> Galleries >> Gallery Three: Expressing human values > No Sale, Palace of the Governors, Santa Fe, New Mexico, 2003
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21-MAR-2003

No Sale, Palace of the Governors, Santa Fe, New Mexico, 2003

On a cold spring day, Native American crafts were selling slowly in front of the oldest public building in the US, Santa Fe's Palace of the Governors. I concentrated my attention on a vendor whose display was separated from the others. Although ignored and chilled to the bone, she stays the course as animated shoppers browse in the background. This contrast conveys the point of the picture via human values – determination and endurance.

Canon PowerShot G2
1/50s f/2.8 at 9.3mm hide exif
Full EXIF Info
Date/Time21-Mar-2003 01:07:34
MakeCanon
ModelPowerShot G2
Flash UsedNo
Focal Length9.3 mm
Exposure Time1/50 sec
Aperturef/2.8
ISO Equivalent
Exposure Bias
White Balance (-1)
Metering Modematrix (5)
JPEG Quality (6)
Exposure Program
Focus Distance65.540 m

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Guest 12-Jan-2005 07:51
sorry again I supose I ment "disappointed"
Phil Douglis12-Jan-2005 02:58
Thanks, Mikel, for adding your thoughts on this image. I am not sure what you mean by "decievement" --did you feel that is she being deceived by her customers because they are not interested in her jewelry? To deceive is to trick or lie to someone, so that can't be what you mean.

As for feeling left out, yes -- these tourists seem to buying jewelry from everyone but her. And yes, there is sadness here -- she is worthy of more attention than she is getting. I can't agree that my image shows us how little interest interest there is in native culture, however. This market draws buyers from all over the world. They may not be paying much attention to what she happens to be selling at the moment, but other native Americans are doing quite well at this moment elsewhere in the picture.
Guest 11-Jan-2005 22:42
determination and endurance good words too express in this image, I wold also add decievement too it. Some how it is sad too see this women enduring such a hard day with no turist interested in her objects. It is like some kind of fribolity is floating in the air between the buyers. All of them go to the mass were probably they think that thei'll find what they are looking for while just a few feet away there is a person that may have even better stuff but since she is not in the group it is not worthed. On the other hand, I also see a sad story behind all of it. As the native have to survive throe selling their souvenirs to their conquerors for saying it in a way. How can such a proud people have to fall to such extreem to survive, I just think it is not fair. Realy, I think that the first women in the photo is a vivid image of the little real interest we have in the native culture, in the sence that no one pays her any attention whatsoever.
Phil Douglis06-Jan-2005 00:41
Hi, Dandan. Nobody has ever mentioned the clean, tightly regulated look of this market before, nor have they gone on to tell me that this picture is not only about lost sales but also lost freedom.

As for those interpretations you mention, they are important. You are interpreting my image when you tell me that it is all about losing the freedom to present herself to us as she really would want to.
Guest 05-Jan-2005 14:11
I see another incongruity here…For an open air craft market, this place is very clean and it seemed to be extremely regulated, even the blankets of the vendors are exactly the same size. I felt like in such a tightly regulated environment, she lost her freedom to present herself… and has been tight up in a sense (from her body language)…

I guess whatever the interpretations we have is not important here. The picture is talking to us in the language we could understand individually! I love this one!
Phil Douglis26-Dec-2004 20:39
Yes, Zebra, that is part of the message here. I want you to empathize with this forgotten person, and make you think what she must be thinking at this moment.
Guest 26-Dec-2004 18:28
She is waiting,with a little unhappy,because the booths behind hers are all visited by travellers.I guess she is whispering to herself,"come on,come on...your follish,why you come here yet?"
Phil Douglis05-Dec-2004 01:20
A fascinating observation, Clara. You sense concealment here. This vendor is trying not to show how she feels about her customers, because she does not want to possibly lose a sale, but yet you feel her displeasure. I had not thought of this message before, but once you brought it up, it becomes an indelible part of this image for me. Thank you for adding still another layer of meaning to this picture.
Guest 04-Dec-2004 18:05
It is patience and some hidden displease to the costumers because of the hard job, selling.
Phil Douglis04-Dec-2004 07:39
Hi, Nut. Abstraction, incongruity, and human values can be used all at once, yet you can indeed emphasize one over the others. It all depends on how you structure your idea and your image. This picture, as I've said in my explanation, is primarily about determination and endurance. Both are human values. They are obvious. She is cold but is determined to stay, to earn a livelihood, to endure. I emphasize this by structuring the picture around her, isolating her from the rest of the picture by placing in the foreground of this image. So the human values take precedence here.

The other principles work primarily as context. The incongruities, for example, are far more subtle. The woman sits alone, while the other vendors are busy with customers. The other vendors group their jewelry together, but this woman holds hers apart.

Abstraction is the least visible of three principles in this shot, but it is still there. We can see everything about this woman, her expression, her jewelry, her blankets. But all the other vendors are abstracted -- only suggested. They merge into each other as a faceless mass in the background, as do many of the customers. They are all context, and abstracted context at that. You must imagine them, because you can't really see them that well.

I don't know if this answers your question or not, Nut. There is no rule that tells us when and how to blend the three principles together, or when or how to make one of the principles dominate the image. It all depends upon the goal of a particular picture and then how you choose to put the picture together to make it work.
nut 04-Dec-2004 07:00
How can you use an abstract, incongruities and human values without overlap between each
other but bring up one thing upper than others?
Phil Douglis04-Dec-2004 04:17
I can't quite understand what your question asks, Nut. Can you ask me again in a different way? I will try to answer it for you. Thanks, Phil
nut 03-Dec-2004 23:26
Shop-shop environment seem so far and fade away as her background. But why I feel the
painfulness from all vendors than all buyers here. I like the "pass-through" since start
to fading stop. Opposite feeling between this vendor on the left and a moving buyer from
the right make me think. How can you point the meaning of this painfulness (but won't give up) of this vendor out of this frame since the first sight you saw it?
Phil Douglis03-Dec-2004 21:03
Great to hear from you again, Nut, and I am glad you picked this image to comment on. It is one of my favorites, yet has received relatively little attention here on pbase. I am fascinated by your view of "sale/no sale" as an incongruity -- I think you are stretching its definition a bit too far here. But I do see the incongruity in the fact that she appears to be lost in her own world of "determination and endurance" and has separated herself, mentally at least from the "shop-shop" environment. I love your phraseology, Nut. "Shop-Shop" environment, indeed!
nut 03-Dec-2004 19:04
To use the incongruity in term of context between "Sale-No Sale", is to identify more deeply into the meaning of into the meaning of "determination and endurance". What is in her mind
is separated herself from her shop-shop environment.
nut 26-Nov-2004 05:03
Agreed.
Jacques vic 16-Dec-2003 00:02
Très belle photo."Carrée" à souhait. Le rapport de la couleur brique du sol et des bleus est magnifique.Ainsi que la lumière venant de droite qui se refléte sur le mur principal, et la sensation étonnante du mouvement du sol,polychromie aussi très bien rendue.Un régal.Merci Monsieur P. Douglis.
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